Who Ya Got? New York vs. Chicago
Pizza
I don't think this one is even an argument, but there are some folks out there who claim that the deep-dish Chicago-style pizza is better than NY-style thin crust pies. Those people are wrong. Dead wrong. While the deep-dish is delicious, it ain't pizza. Not in my book. It's some kind of pizza-like substance. Gimme a nice thin crust pie from John's of Bleecker Street and I'm in heaven!
Winner: New York
Hot Dogs
While I love me a nice Nathan's hot dog or a handful of dogs from Gray's Papaya, I don't know if they compare to the Chicago-style dog shown in the mosaic above. Pickle spear, celery salt, poppy-seed bun, onions, relish, hot peppers and tomatoes? That's a good freakin' hot dog, y'all!
Winner: Chicago
Baseball Stadiums
Another blow to my city of choice here. I haven't been to the new Yankee Stadium yet, I did see a few hundred games at the old Stadium and it was great. Shea was a dump, but Citi Field looks nice. But c'mon...Wrigley? There is no contest. Easily one of my favorite places on Earth. And I have to say that I had one of my best days at a ballgame while at new Comiskey. Great food and great people. Chicago is a big winner here, I'm sorry to report.
Winner: Chicago
Baseball Fans/Mascots
Ronnie Woo Woo is a lot of fun at Cubs' games. For about five minutes. Then you realize that he is pretty much a crazy homeless dude who can yell really loud. He's got nothing compared with Freddy over at Yankee Stadium. I actually had the pleasure of sitting down and having a long conversation with Freddy once on a subway ride home from the old Stadium. Nice guy and a great story. Much rather listen to the pleasant sounds of a spoon on an old pot than Ronnie yelling "woo" at the top of his lungs.
Winner: Freddy "sez" New York
Hmm...so it's a tie after four heats. A classic push. Maybe I should have picked 5 topics, eh? But that would mean I would have to edit my mosaic, and I ain't doing that. Crap! What other classic NY vs. Chicago battles could we include? Steakhouses? Beer? Nightlife? Skylines? Subways vs The El? Native sons and daughters? SCTV vs Saturday Night Live?
To be continued?
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Note: Remember to play the Bug-Eyed Trivia Challenge every day. Freddy "sez" don't let the bastards get you down!
48 comments:
Well I of course beg to differ on the pizza. Then again, I think it is like comparing apples and oranges, they're not the same. The thing I always cite about pizza in Chicago is that no 2 are the same, whereas it seems to me NY pizza is just that, NY pizza.
You can get a deep dish one place and the place across the street is totally different. We also like the totally thin "cracker crust" pizza. Just last night we had a "stuffed" pizza from the place down the street and it was excellent, but totally different than the place we usually get it from.
Another diff I notice is almost no one gets a cheese pizza in Chicago, it's gotta have meat!
Another fun difference is we do not cut our regular or thin crust pizzas into wedges, always squares.
I've had Nathan's, not from THE Nathan's as my Queens born and bred wife tells me is the best, but rather from the store bought pack. I do think they are good but they seem to have an afterburn. Vienna hot dogs rule, that is your standard Chicago brand, the only way to go when you get a Chicago style dog.
Yeah, I am somewhat of a connoisseur, and I've got the girth to prove it, LOL.
Finally, the Cubs suck major ass, Go White Sox!
Wil Harrison.com
Yes I agree about the pizza! New York hands down!
Everything else, I will take your word on that!!!
HAPPY TUESDAY!!!
Having grown up in Joisey, and lived in Chicago, there is no pizza competition, N.Y. pizza hands down.
As for the SCTV vs. SNL, wouldn't that really be Canada against New York ?
The hot dog arguments is a false one. It has to be the hot dog itself, not the stuff you put on top of it, that is the deciding factor. Personally, I think Nathan's are overrated, so I'm taking this category out and replacing it with museums. Field Museum vs. Museum of Natural History.
I go with Field Museum, since it's just as cool, not as many crowds to deal with, and also right next to an aquarium, a planetarium and within walking distance of Soldier Field.
Chicago wins. But both are still way better than Hartford.
Uhhhhmmmm, don't you know pizza is supposed to have crazy sauces, fruits and bbq sauce on it? ;)
/raised in California
You could also go by sports teams.
Yankees v. White Sox. Not a contest really. Yanks in a blow-out.
Mets v. Cubs. Closer, especially since the mets built a decent stadium, but the Cubs have a cool factor that the Mets don't, even if the Mets have won a World Series within the last 25 years. I'll take the Cubs.
Knicks v. Bulls. Yet another blow-out, but this time Chicago takes it.
Giants/Jets vs. Da' Bears. New York has two teams, but neither has been hilariously sent up by Chris Farley on SNL. I'll take Da' Bears. Plus the Jets suck and the Giants priced their best fans out in their new stadium. Give it to Chicago, although the Giants make it close.
Blackhawks vs. Rangers. Close one. I like the Rangers and they play in the best hockey arena around. But the Blackhawks have the best jersey in sports, and probably a better immediate future. I give it to Chicago again.
Clealry, I have way to much time on my hands.
Speaking as a Chicagoan, the best pizza is actually in Cleveland. I would give the hot dog to Chicago except I think you really have to think of it as two separate and incomparable things with each being an entity of its own. We don't have Sorbet's onion sauce here and we don't have a Papaya King (lunch at which is on my Bucket List to try before I die). You guys do more saurkraut, we do sport peppers and celery salt. So I dunno - I think it depends on what you want.
Also, I've long ago stopped trying to make this comparison because though I'm a homer here, NYC is absolutely my second choice in all things right after my hometown.
Be that as it may it's impossible to ferret out sports teams because that all depends on what you grew up with. But I must say the Cubs do totally suck and the White Sox are my boys - we even threw a World Series, what has New York done to compare to that huh. Huh? ANSWER ME!
Be careful about SNL though - going back to Ackroyd, Belushi and Radner and continuing on unto this day, a fuckton of folks there started at Second City. I auditioned there once as well, but they took Bill Murray instead. The bastards.
I think the best thing to do is just take each town for what it can give you. I know I'm supposed to get all up in people's faces about my city but it's too early, it's kind of a set-up question and I like NY too much to want to fight about it.
Chicago is neighborhoods, NY is part of America's mythology. New York is more connected to a national consciousness, Chicago is a place you come to be surprised in. You're louder, we're more hometown. I think it all depends on what you like.
I much prefer the BVI, actually...
of course that would be SABRETT's. Coffee isn't ready yet awright!?
pizza, not even close. Can't get better anywhere in the world than NY.
Hot dogs, who gives a shit, they're all the same - made from lips and assholes. (not that lips and assholes are all bad) But i do believe they where first made popular in coney island.
baseball - who cares
basketball - chicago wins here because of jordan/grant and charles smith. I hate pippen so he gets no credit. Charles smith get the credit because the poor bastard couldn't get a basket in four put back attempts under the basket. (still pisses me off)
hockey - the blackhawks have great sweaters, but they can never match the islanders 4 cup run. (i hate the rangers)
wheres the beef? Chicago
What state is chicago in anyway?
Wil - I agree that comparing the two styles of "pizza" is silly. You guys should stop calling what you eat pizza. That will settle the argument. ;)
Michelle - Hey, you are a Brooklyn gal. Have you had DiFara's pizza? It's someplace in the middle of Brooklyn and it is supposed to be da best!
Paticus - I know most/all of those kids were from Canada, but isn't "second city" a reference to Chicago? Isn't that where the Second City Comedy troupe came from?
Limpy - I dunno...that Hartford Civic Center is pretty nice!
Hilly - the woman goes from one place of cultural dispair (CA) to another (FL) and thinks she can join in on a conversation on pizza? C'mon! ;)
Limpy - well, I dig the NFL but I really only care about baseball. I include all baseball history when comparing the two cities. So the Yankees/Mets/NY Giants/Brooklyn Dodgers clearly destroy the Cubs and ChiSox. Clearly.
RW - I've eaten at the original Papaya King way more often than Gray's, but I prefer Gray's in a weird way because they are exactly this same. Go figure. I love Chicago with a passion. We were just thinking about visiting Chicago at some point this summer so it got me to thinking about things. Each has its own charm. And, um, BVI?? What dat?
2abes - Who gives a damn about hot dogs and baseball?!? HERESY!!! You aren't allowed back here for 1 hour! ;)
I can only vouch for the pizza debate here and I much prefer the thin crust to the Chicago style. Both pizzas are good and tasty, but I can eat more slices with the thin crust.
Marty - welcome to the light side of the pizza force!
BVI - British Virgin Islands. Skin cancer and liver destruction at an affordable price. Much more acceptable than either city in question. Let me know when you're coming.
btw - that Cleveland thing was an aside by New Yawker Anthony Bordain who didn't SAY Cleveland pizza was best but intimated it, in my opinion.
Thin crust and deep dish pizzas are both shit. I'll just take some Pizza Hut.
Hot dogs shouldn't have any of that crap on them. Ketchup, mayo, cheese. That's it.
Baseball is boring.
Since I will never go to New York and I'm actually going to Chicago in July, I'll have to vote for Chicago because it seems like less of an armpit of a town.
Earl- You are correct, sir(of course).
RW - Gotcha, and will do if/when we come to Chicago. Sidenote: I love Anthony Bourdain's show, but I find him kinda annoying. Which is weird, because Gia's brother in-law says I sound exactly like him. I don't hear it. Neither does Gia, but he is the third guy to tell me that.
Avitable - Holy shit! I might have to rinse my eyes after reading that comment. Pizza Hut? Ketchup and mayo on a hot dog? Baseball is boring? NYC is an armpit? All this coming from a guy who lives in Central Florida? Wow. Just wow.
Paticus - Actually you were right. The television show was from the Toronto offshoot of the Second City troupe.
I consider myself an Angeleno who just happens to live in Orlando. And Los Angeles is so much better than any other big city in the country.
deep-dish pizza makes me want to vomit..
winner :NY
Ketchup on a hot dog is a crime against nature, but let's not forget Avitable's birth point of origin... near where they wear those silly hats with the colonial B on the front. Something about a green monster...
Avitable - what have you got against NYC? It is such a great city. I can't compare it to LA because I have never been, but I have also never really wanted to go to LA. It's way down there on my "to visit" list. San Fran and San Diego seem more interesting to me.
Slyde - I like the deep dish stuff, it's just pizza. It's something else.
RW - Ketchup is my last-choice condiment. It's ok on burgers, but I could live without it. Fries? Eh! I like fries either plain or with some mayo and vinegar. But I can at least stomach it on fries. Never on a hot dog. That is just wrong.
Slyde - It's just NOT pizza, is what I meant to say.
It just seems like a dirty, nasty city with nothing to offer. It's the lowest on cities that I want to visit.
And ketchup is only good when mixed with mayo - it's a great combo!
Adam - What NY has to offer is the best restaurants in the country, the best nightlife, great museums, fantastic Broadway plays/musicals, the most wonderful people in the world (ask Dawg and Poppy), incredible history, and most of all it is the energy. The city is glowing with energy. Dirty, nasty city is something that described it in the 70's and 80's. It is much cleaner and friendly now, although I think some of the grime was charming. Times Square is like Disney now. Blech. The rest of the city is fabu.
But I hear you, and I get it. I've never been to LA and my entire opinion of it is shaped from the news and from TV and films. Dirty, nasty city with nothing to offer. Bunch of phony people living phony lives in a phony city. I'm obviously totally wrong, but that is why it is so far down on my cities to visit list.
Wait? Did RW say you were born in Boston?
Yup. I was born in Boston. I'm actually going back to visit family this weekend.
Adam - very cool. Boston is a town that I dig in a big way. Besides the Red Sox, of course. But my real last name and my famous Irish relatives will often garner me free booze when I am out and about in town. Plus it is so small that it is kinda cute. It could fit in Brooklyn's back pocket!
Since I currently hail from the Sports Champions Capital of the world, I will not weigh in on this sports city debate. I have had both dogs and pizza in both cities, and for me, I heart NYC.
Damnit, I need "another" beer. It's food blogging today. I LOVE thin crust pizza, ANY. Stadiums...we'll ours sucks. The new outdoor Twins stadium is looking pretty cool...we shall see! Lambeau's a pretty nice stadium??
HAPPY TUESDAY!!
- Jennifer
I actually like deep dish or stuffed crust better than thin.
*ducks out before rotten food is thrown*
Oh man, now I'm hungry!
Candy - grrr...Boston!!! ;)
Jenn - that new outdoor stadium is gonna be awfully cold in April and October (if they make the playoffs). Brrr.
Callie - My whole point is that it isn't pizza. It's something else. A delicious something else, but something else nonetheless.
Paige - my work here is done. ;)
The pizza isn't even close. New York, by a mile.
I've never had a New York hot dog but I'm going to call it even. I mean, seriously, how can you fuck up a hot dog?
Of the four stadiums in question, I've only been to Wrigley. It's a dump! I'll never understand how people can feel such love for a place that's been soaked in beer and urine for more than 100 years! ... I'm voting for New York.
Sports fans? I'll never understand East Coast sports fans. Never. Chicago wins this one, hands down.
By my book, New York wins!
Seals - but how does it compare to St. Louis? ;) I know Wrigley is tight, smelly, old and anything else you wanna call it. I just love the atmosphere, the people, the ivy, the neighborhood and the feel for how old it is. Fenway has that, to some extant. Yankee Stadium used to as well.
Couple things from Chicago again - you know my wife and I have pizza here just about twice a month and the last time I had "deep dish" was, like, I wanna say 1993. Deep Dish was invented here and so I guess it's a "Chicago pizza" but I'm not so sure. I don't much care for it, and the bulk of the get-togethers you go to - Super Bowl parties or whatever - the Deep mDish is no where to be seen. So there's that.
But I'll back Seals up on Wrigley Field - and take it a step farther. It's kind of a stereotype by now but, I still believe it to be true, Wrigley Field is like a frat party. Nobody under 30 is probably there for the baseball or would know what a Hit and Run is. They gab on their cell phones, try to get a fuck buddy for the night and sing their song in the bottom of the 7th. "Cubbies". Who the hell calls their team "Cubbies"?
The White Sox, being on the south side, have their roots in the Union Stockyards and steel mills and have always been a more working class crowd. It's a bit rougher - in the old days the fight in the stands was better than the fight in the team - but there is this feeling of a more baseball than a social thing. Then there's the bad news that lends a kind of aura over the team. 1919, Disco demolition, first team to put names on the backs and have an exploding scoreboard (Bill Veeck is a saint here), and before he went to the North Side Harry Carey was here alongside Jimmy Piersall who would have a psychotic break every once in a while.
The new stadium for the Sox is good in that it's still "close" to the play but it's far superior to Wrigley or even the old Comiskey Park - which was another historic dump we used to have. I mean - get a Polish sausage and lather it up with horseradish mustard. The food has always been better with the Sox.
I will make a small argument about football that will run like this:
Bronco Nagurski, Dick Butkis, Walter Payton, George Halas, Jim McMahon, Refrigerator Perry, Mike Ditka, Joe Fortunato, Ed Obradovich, Mike Singletary and Buddy Ryan. We'll let that stand for that part.
RW - I hear what you are saying about Wrigley. And maybe time is affecting my memory. The last time I was there was in 2000 or 2001, and it was 1998 before that. So it has been a while. I was a bit more of a partying pup back in those days.
I will always say that new Comiskey has the best stadium food I have ever had. Period. I couldn't get over how good the food was there compared to the crap they serve at Yankee Stadium.
Ya gotta love Bill Veeck. The man was...different. :) One great semi-true story about him is that he tried to buy the Philadelphia Phillies in 1942 and stock it with stars from the Negro Leagues, but Mountain Landis vetoed the sale. There is some argument over whether that is true or not, but the main did integrate the American League while owner of the Indians in '47.
Plus he hired Max Patkin as a coach for the Tribe. That move alone makes him cool in my book. Add Eddie Gaedel, sound effects, fireworks, supporting Curt Flood, Minnie Minosa, getting Harry Caray to sing "Take Me Out..." and Disco Demolition night to that and it only proves the man was a genius.
A baseball man.
There are so few of them left in the world.
I had the distinct pleasure of having Bill Veeck buy me a beer or two at Murphy's across from Wrigley Field when he was a daily visitor to the centerfield bleachers before he died. We gabbed for an hour. Just me and him. I thought it was the most unique thing in the world - turns out I'm one of a thousand guys he's done that to before he died. Never forget it though.
oh and...? When his Dad was working as a promotions guy for the Cubs it was Bill who planted the vines in Wrigley. Not "had the idea" - but got down and planted them with a small crew.
He's everywhere.
St. Louis, the city, finishes behind almost any city except for maybe Detroit or Gary, Indiana. However, you did happen to pick a couple of subjects where St. Louis could do OK.
St. Louis-style pizza, namely Imo's Pizza, has a very thin crust with a local processed cheese called Provel. I love it but at least half of the people here despise it, especially the transplants. IMHO, Imo's is better than Chicago-style but not as good as New York.
The first "hot dog on a bun" was invented by a St. Louisan. It was also first introduced as ballpark food in St. Louis. Chicago and New York took the dog and ran with it, but you've got to give St. Louis a strong third place over any other comers.
Ballpark? The new Busch is probably about like the new stadiums in New York and Chicago's U.S. Cellular Field. New York probably spent the most money, so I'll put them No. 1. Wrigley Field puts Chicago in third.
Baseball fans? St. Louis wins in a rout. I could go on, but it's pretty much common knowledge that baseball's best fan-base is in St. Louis.
1. New York
2. St. Louis
3. Chicago
RW - Wow! That is very cool, and I didn't know that. You know that Wrigley wasn't built for the Cubs, right?
Seals - I won't even argue. Every time I see the Cards on television I am amazed at the sea of Cardinal red in the stands. Great fans! Boston, I hate to say it, has the best (most knowledgeable) fans of any stadium I have been to. I also hate to say it, but New York has become terrible for it. My last NY/Boston game at the Stadium the Sox fans were much louder and far more knowledgeable. Since the mid-90's the type of fan in NY has changed drastically. More corporate VIPs than fans. Shame.
Sssh... there's a quiz on the Whales later!
Can't we all just get along !? Being in 'Bama, I'd be happy with either !
Gotta go with NY, overall. I love Chicago, too, but I'd pick NY over it almost any time.
RW - Mum is the word.
Heff - But 'bama has it's own charms, neh?
Sybil - that's because you are both lovely and smart.
After yesterday's complete conversion to Newyorkism, I vote New York down the party line. GO YANKEES!
(My mom is swearing at me right now. We're supposed to go BOSOX.)
Poppy - if you can still love NY after a day at the DMV, then you REALLY love NY!
I'be actually seen Freddy at Fordham basketball games and even a Mets game. The man gets around.
What's great is to see Busch Stadium packed on a random Tuesday against the Nationals or something. It's crazy.
I know I guy who lives in Springfield, Mo., (four hours south-west of St. Louis) who never misses a game. That's a hell of a drive, even if he stays overnight once in a while. Crazy.
Uncool - OK, Fordham I get...but at Mets games? You sure? Maybe it was an inter-league game with the Yanks? Because that would be just wrong!
Seals - Once in a while? If it was a four hour trip home I would stay over every night.
I am soo behind in your blog. I hadn't realized. Anyway, I was born in Chicago, so clearly... the above discussions were moot.
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